How do you relate to the BCB characters?

[ILB]

The main part of the topic, however, is here. I'm just throwing the question out there, to see what kind of response we get.

Now, I raised this question in the "Lucy Fanclub" thread: Why does it seem like Lucy (and McCain) are the only characters people can relate to? jay and I (with some input from blaze and ved) brainstormed and argued, and found some common ground for the main characters:

- Lucy: She is a reserved person who is defensive when it comes to her emotions. This has led to her being left out and misunderstood by people that do not know her. Is this why many can feel kinship with her?
- McCain: He is not afraid to speak his mind, and when he states a fact he does it bluntly. As a result, he is an outcast. Do people relate with his know-it-allism?
- Paulo: Definitely a jerk with a heart of gold. He is like a lobster; soft on the inside but hard (and also reddish) on the outside. He does, however, have a boyish charm to him. But mayhaps his long time as a jerk has alienated him from us?
- Abraham: Why can't people relate more to him? His backstory and pre-Daisy demeanour is sadly close to many. And his turnaround after he met Daisy is also typical for those who have experienced what he has. Is it too difficult to talk about, maybe?
- Tess: A girl with a past she is not proud of, and who is scorned because of it. We all have skeletons in the closet, and they may or may not have impacted people's opinions of us. We should feel closer to her than we do - or is Tess's skeleton so large that we have problems with feeling akin to her?
- Daisy: Daisy is highly intelligent, and she has a naively gleeful outlook on life. Her problem, however, is that people are easily annoyed by her persistent cheerfulness. Also, her portion of drama has been minimal compared to that of other characters - do these traits make her an alien?
- Sue: She is often left out, even though she tries to reach the foreground several times. And like Daisy, she is smart. Though she has recently been featured heavily, some may still empathise with her position. Or does Lucy take up that spot?
- Michael: A popular and happy boy with his head in the clouds. He is loved by many and can't possibly love all of them back, so he settles on someone else. Years of being there for Lucy have made him more cynical and conceited; does this reduce him too much in our eyes to make us relate to him?

We never got to discuss the rest of the characters, but they do have some defining traits that people might relate to:

- David: Flimsy as a butterfly, but possibly as destructive as the Hulk. He is a comic relief, and there are many like him out there. (I know I am. ^_^) Or is he too Flanderised for people to recognise themselves in him?
- Kizuna: Always supportive of the love of her life, she does (did) tend to get hurt a lot. Her clumsiness is one thing many can relate to, as is her "lovesickness". Maybe we don't want to associate too closely with someone like her...
- Lily: A wise and maternal figure that does a lot and wants little in return. Perhaps too perfect for us?
- Amaya: I included her in the poll because many of us (or them, depending on where you stand) are silent and reserved, but still have a positive outlook on life. Or is she too obscure?
- Yashy: Come on. There must be at least one cheeky bastard around here. ^_^
- Augustus: We have little to go on when it comes to his personality, but his status in the comic is easier. He is a neutral character that hangs around and isn't too much noticed - nearly all of his demeanour speaks of mystery. Do people have bad memories of him, possibly?

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That should be that, mostly. Now, let us discuss the 'why's and 'why not's of the topic. Why can or can't we relate to the BCB characters?

Oh, by the way, I voted Abraham. My history isn't near as tragic, and I have a wonderful family, but I can relate to his person.

[jay]

Sounds good to me. I eagerly await your next post! And thanks for setting this one up by the way. It didn't even occur to me to make a poll out of it.

[ILB]

Now, the sentiments expressed in the "Lucy Fanclub" topic are as follows:

jay said:

Michael seems too perfect to me. Good grades, amazing physical skills, all too willing to put himself at risk. I find it hard to empathize with perfection like that.

And Paulo I'm sure people feel a kinship to, but his character seems way too drama free to have much impact. Sure he has the whole Tess issue, and now possibly a Lucy issue too, but compared to some of the others?

Now Abbey, I'm surprised, doesn't seem to have NEARLY the following he should have. His childhood is all to common these days.

This was in response to me asking why so few seemed to relate to other characters than Lucy and McCain. I replied:

ILB said:

Well, of course, if you draw in all the factors comparison becomes difficult. The centre of Lucy's personality, however, seems to be her inability to connect or show her feelings, and her defensiveness when either of this is brought up.
Michael is a popular guy, and what might be called a "jock" if it wasn't for his being nice. I know people that might relate to him, although they aren't very common.
Now Abraham, I'm surprised as well. Many families seem to be torn up by violence at home, and Abbey has a backstory that many may relate to in one way or the other. I know I can, although that has less to do with my family and more to do with school.
Paulo is a jerk with a soft side, or rather a soft soul with a rough exterior, something that makes him similar to Lucy in many ways - although he is far more boyish in his appearance and approach.
Daisy - why don't people seem to relate to her? There are millions of Daisies in the worlld, although admittedly she's quite Flanderised. In my class alone there were 5-6 of her, about 15 per cent of the class.
Tess I'm also surprised about. Though maybe not for the same reasons, many girls are like her. At such large schools there will always be one or more Tesses.
Now, McCain, McCain is quite understandable. Experience shows that 95% of Internet dwellers are know-it-alls, and even worse, most of them actually know what they're talking about. ^_^

blaze's reply:

blaze said:

i can only empathise with Sue (even though she is opposite gender) as i have all to well been left out of a crowd.

ved also expressed his thoughts:

ved said:

I myself am a Lucy-loney/Mike-happy mix with a bit of (Daisy/McCain)-smarts.

I can relate with some of the characters, but mainly pieces of them.

And finally, jay's retort to my post:

jay said:

McCain is like-able, but he's just kinda one dimensional.

Paulo's deeper character type has only recently come to the forefront. Up to the point where he confessed he liked Lucy back in earlier grades, we really had little more than his lecherous attitude to go by. He didn't really even show that much of a tender side until he met Tess. That shook him up though. So it may still take time before people start to identify with him.

I think the reason people don't relate to Daisy is two fold. One, her portion of actual drama was sudden, short, and quickly resolved. She tried to corner Mike, got rejected at the fair, and gets saved from FF Cat by her now boyfriend, so her impact on the readers beyond her normal personality has been minimal. Two, her normal personality is, well, it's predictable and cheery. To be honest, I find her somewhat annoying. Don't get me wrong, I like her, but she's just too perky to empathize with compared to the rest of the cast.

As for Tess, you bring up a good point. Many of us have done things we aren't proud of. And even if no one else antagonizes us over it, we continue to punish ourselves. And if nothing else, she's the one softening up Paulo. That deserves respect.

So, you said: "Well, of course, if you draw in all the factors comparison becomes difficult."

Might as well make it difficult though eh? If we're going to go deeper into why and how we relate to characters. By the way, I'm really enjoying this, but I'm wondering if we should take it to a new thread. This IS supposed to be the Lucy Fan thread after all. Thoughts?

And now, I'll do something I promise never to do again (unless things get really bad) - I'm going to double post...

[ILB]

Paulo's deeper character type has only recently come to the forefront. Up to the point where he confessed he liked Lucy back in earlier grades, we really had little more than his lecherous attitude to go by. He didn't really even show that much of a tender side until he met Tess. That shook him up though. So it may still take time before people start to identify with him.

This is partly true - but remember that the barking story was shown long before Tess. We got to see a different side of him early on, and when Lucy confessed that she once had a crush on Paulo, we also saw a lot of his inner self. I daresay it was possible to relate to him fairly early in the comic. That said, it is true that he developed a fair lot after he met Tessa.

One, (Daisy's) portion of actual drama was sudden, short, and quickly resolved (...) so her impact on the readers beyond her normal personality has been minimal. Two, her normal personality is, well, it's predictable and cheery. To be honest, I find her somewhat annoying. Don't get me wrong, I like her, but she's just too perky to empathize with compared to the rest of the cast.

Her drama did last for some time, though. She was in love with Mike for a long time, and though that was largely undramatic, so was most of the story at that time. The rejection, however, was short - I agree with you there - but I think she has been shown as a complete character more than you give her credit for. Her blissful cheer might be somewhat annoying, I grant you that, but people should still be able to relate to her. And not everyone experience drama to the degree that the BCB cast does. But you may be right that drama is required for us to really empathise.

So, you said: "Well, of course, if you draw in all the factors comparison becomes difficult."

Might as well make it difficult though eh? If we're going to go deeper into why and how we relate to characters.

I'm just saying that nobody could relate to anyone if we chose to look at them as complete and unseparable entities. We must take both them and ourselves apart to find something we can really feel akin to.
Perhaps we mean the same thing, only with different words?


By the way, is there anything you would like to discuss in regard to the other characters?
(I really need to shorten my posts. ^_^)

[ved]

Looking this through, I'm actually more Amaya, Daisy and Mike.

Amaya, though a support character, is silent and thinks well of the future. We don't know too much about her, but enough to relate.
Daisy is always the cheerful one, but she has always longed for more.
Mike is just doing what he usually does and he knows that he can't please everyone, though he does try to keep everyone on a happier side.

Me?
Always the silent type, I tend to watch things happen than be a part of it.
I don't see badly of my life, but I wish there was more to it.
But I hate disappointing people, which is why I often isolate myself.
Funny how I can think this up on a keyboard, but I can't find the words when I'm talking to people.

[ILB]

By the way, sorry for only enabling one vote. I guess most people can find parts of themselves in several characters, but it's far more tidy to just enable one choice. I mean, I see myself as a conglomerate of all the characters, but I think Abbey is more similar to me than, say, Lily is. If you want to choose more than one, then do so in a post.

I assume that's what you did, ved - voted for Amaya, but added Daisy and Mike in your reply?

[ved]

Yes I did.
It's easy to get around things with a bit of common sense.
So, anyone else who'd like to say something?

[toastyjester]

Out of all the characters I guess I relate to Sue the most, in the fact that when I'm with a group of my friends I usually stay in the background. To be honest though, I choose to be in the background myself, so I never really tried to fight the power.

Amaya is my second best pick though, if that matters.

[Sind]

I'm mostly a mix of Sue and Abbey, and voted for Sue as I don't have the tragic past thingy =/

I'm thinking many of the characters are flanderised, and thus hard to relate too. Also, the only thing we know about Augustus is that he's mysterious, and since most people know their own intension, it's probably hard think of oneself as mysterious...

[jay]

Augustus I just can't seem to wrap my mind around. He seems almost well meaning at times, but there is that creepy shadowy group he seems wrapped up in. Although we don't get to clearly see who he is working with, I suspect it may be the cat and dog pair from "confrontation". Oh the story telling possibilities... *drool*

If I were to list all the characters that I relate to/see myself in:

Lucy. Her childhood reminds me too much of my own. And her defensiveness too. And on a side note, the which cat character are you quiz pegged me for Lucy too.

Mike. For the limited number of friends I have I do tend to try and keep them all happy, but that's about the extent of it.

Tess. Oh dear god do I have skeletons. And in an interesting reversal, I can relate to her because she WAS exactly the kind of person who turned me into a Lucy, but she WANTS to redeem herself.

Abbey. Been violent, done violent things. It's hard to keep your temper in check when all you want is to be left alone (my personal desire, not reflected in Abbey), and no one will do

Kizuna. Yeah, I'm a klutz too. I'll miss you Kiz!

Lily. I've been known to try and sort out people too. Heck, people come to me for help sorting themselves out. Lily is a much more mature Mike in that sense. She shares the same desire to help, or interfere, that I do.

You know something. I'm a guy, and I relate more to the females of this group than the males. I wonder what a certain bizzare psychologist from the past would have to say about that. Not that I mind of course.

[jay]

Looks like I'm going to have to double post too. Yer not alone ILB. By the way, how on earth do you quote someone on this board? I've never figured out how to do it on any message board.

When I said "Might as well make it difficult though eh?" I think I misunderstood what you were saying. Yeah, taking the characters as a whole unit rather than pulling them apart to get various facets of their personalities does make things more difficult.

My purpose in taking them as a whole instead is that it makes them so much more real, and I tend to have an easier time relating to a complete character, rather than facets of them. For some people, it's easier the other way around. 6 of this, half a dozen of the other and all that.

With regards to Paulo, it looks like I may have to go back and reread the series. I seem to have lost track of when certain parts of his past were revealed in the time line.

I'd be happy to discuss any and all characters, from childhood history, to anticipated futures, to personality traits that make them endearing.

[ILB]

By the way, how on earth do you quote someone on this board? I've never figured out how to do it on any message board.

You add quote tags. Just put [quote] in front of what you want to cite, and [/quote] at the end. If you want to add authors, post the first tag like [quote author=(author here)]. It is also possible to add date and time.

When I said "Might as well make it difficult though eh?" I think I misunderstood what you were saying. Yeah, taking the characters as a whole unit rather than pulling them apart to get various facets of their personalities does make things more difficult.

My purpose in taking them as a whole instead is that it makes them so much more real, and I tend to have an easier time relating to a complete character, rather than facets of them. For some people, it's easier the other way around. 6 of this, half a dozen of the other and all that.

You make a good point, and I agree completely. I think I misunderstood you as well ^_^

Also, the only thing we know about Augustus is that he's mysterious, and since most people know their own intension, it's probably hard think of oneself as mysterious...

Not really. It is quite possible to consider oneself mysterious, or at least misunderstood. And many people like cloaking themselves in "a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma", as Sir Winston Churchill once put it (though that was in another context completely). Besides, you don't need to empathise with his enigmatic nature alone.

Also, there are far too many Sues here. ^_^

[jay]

Yeah, I'm kinda curious about this Sue kinship myself.

Sue. She displays a high level of creativity, having written a play and all that. She shows resourcefulness when she managed to summon up McCain to even out the group for the summer trip. And appears quite dedicated to her friends. (Wrecklessly so now that the majority suspicion about her Lucy motives has been proven true.) She's a romantic, that's also clear from her plotting. Beyond that, I really can't make much of her personality.

I can see where people can identify with her, but only slightly.

Maybe you can help expand on her ILB? I'm sure I missed points.

[ILB]

Well, Paulo's comment in the Tess/Daisy situation shows that she is considered book-smart as well. And also a bit annoying. Apart from that, I don't think I can say much more...

[jay]

Well, the only other things I can really add to her at this point are:

1) She is rapidly falling down the respect scale here.

2) She is soon to be a heavily bruised and severely injured cat.